[NENA] Mailing list and communications
Dobrina Teifel
dobrina at teifel.com
Mon Mar 17 21:20:07 CDT 2008
yeah, I also think it would be curious to see the proposed methodology
for this so-called survey. Who will develop the instrument, who will
administer it and how? Unless a market research/polling firm is
hired, I would be skeptical of the validity of any such "survey", done
by one individual.
On Mar 17, 2008, at 2:06 PM, John Ingram wrote:
> I want to read the questions before you begin your survey.
>
> Maxon Stuart B Contractor AFOTEC/A3Z <Stuart.Maxon at afotec.af.mil>
> wrote:
>
> Paul,
> Thank you for your thoughtful discussions...You have motivated me to
> actually sit down and read city and association documentation
> related to NENA membership and voting.
>
> I am confused...From my discussions with Lisa we determined that
> membership in NENA is not optional...All who reside within the
> physical boundaries that define NENA are considered members of the
> association...But it seems that there are two categories of members...
>
> Association By Laws do not explicitly state that all within the
> boundaries are members...They simply say:
>
> Section 1. There shall be two types of membership in NENA - regular
> and business.
> Section 2. A regular membership shall be limited to adult residents
> and/or property owners within the boundaries of NENA.
>
> However...The fifth one seems to infer that all are members and that
> they fall into two categories...voting and non-voting...
>
> Section 5. All members whose dues are current shall be entitled to
> vote at any general meeting of NENA called pursuant to these by-laws.
>
> Although I did see several references to "dues-paying members" in
> the City Code I did not see any reference directly connecting the
> payment of dues with the right to vote...Is voting in association
> elections and on association issues really contingent to paying
> association dues?
>
> I am not a lawyer, but I believe this violates constitutional
> law...In civic matters, directly connecting the payment of money,
> with the right to vote, is considered a poll tax...In 1964 the 24th
> Amendment to the U.S. Constitution disallowed the poll tax as a
> prerequisite for voting in federal elections. In 1966 this
> prohibition was extended to all elections by the U.S. Supreme Court,
> which ruled that such a tax violated the "equal protection" clause
> of the 14th Amendment to the Constitution.
>
> Secondly, can the association ethically present positions to the
> city and claim they represent the views of non-paying members if
> they were not allowed to vote. Given the current state of the
> association (less than 6.6% are paid members) this is clearly a tail
> wagging a dog...If the association is sued for its position, as it
> might have been in the Daskalos development delay case...or someone
> claims their access to emergency services is delayed because the
> Barstow bridge was not built... Does my non-vote and/or non-
> participation status entitle me to share in the liability? What a
> dilemma...
>
> So...low member turnout for votes is not due so much to lack of
> information or involvement...It's due mostly to the lack of an
> ability to vote...interesting
>
> To solve both problems, NENA should Amend the By Laws to
> disassociate the right to vote from the payment of dues.
>
> One question...Are non-voting members allowed to request General
> Meeting agenda items? If so...I would like to request a presentation
> of the Barstow bridge talking points. I plan to survey those most
> affected by the Barstow bridge position. I will focus on all
> developments north of the arroyo up to Florence, and ¼ mile to each
> side...In conjunction with the survey I will invite them to attend
> the next general meeting meeting...Since they have the most to lose
> in this proposition, it will give your advocate a chance show them
> what they will gain in exchange. With their buy-in, we can move
> ahead in confidence. (Don't worry...in the worst case, it will
> simply pit all the north non-voting members against all the south
> non-voting members...HA!)
>
> Maybe we can leverage this issue into a huge membership dues drive...
>
> You might also pass on one must fix typo in the By Laws...ARTICLE X
> - MEETINGS
> Section 4. No election shall be held at a meeting of NENA unless the
> meeting is advertised as noted in Section 2 above.
> I am quite sure that it should read..."as noted in Section 3 above."
>
> Respectfully,
>
> Stu Maxon
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: members-bounces at noreste.org [mailto:members-
> bounces at noreste.org] On Behalf Of Paul Grunwald
> Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2008 6:07 PM
> To: 'NENA'
> Subject: Re: [NENA] Mailing list and communications
>
>
> Apparently I was not clear in my last message. There are not 1800
> members.
> There are 1800 homes within the boundaries of NENA enabling a
> potential
> membership of 1800 families plus homeowners and businesses.
> Membership as
> well as serving on the board is voluntary.
>
> The answer to the majority of your questions can be found in the
> following
> locations:
>
> Nor Este Charter & Bylaws
> http://www.noreste.org/index.html#charter
>
> Neighborhood associations are governed by the Office of Neighborhood
> Coordination: http://www.cabq.gov/planning/nbrcoord/, specifically the
> Neighborhood Recognition Ordinance, also known as O-92-5 found here:
> http://www.cabq.gov/planning/nbrcoord/pdf/0NC-92.pdf
>
> Communications are handled in a number of ways; please see the past
> minutes
> of our meetings in the mailing list archives here:
> http://noreste.org/pipermail/members_noreste.org/
>
> The answers to the rest of your questions are either I don't know
> (such as
> "Does our elected city councilman understand decision theory
> statistics?")
> or the fact that this is a 100% voluntary organization.
>
> Can we expect your membership check and active participation in NENA
> soon?
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Maxon Stuart B Contractor AFOTEC/A3Z
> [mailto:Stuart.Maxon at afotec.af.mil]
> Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2008 8:02 AM
> To: Paul Grunwald; NENA; Nor Este Neighborhood Association Board
> Subject: RE: [NENA] Mailing list and communications
>
> Mr Grunwald, Thank you for your service...I am intrigued...
>
> My observations...Please correct me if I have misunderstood...
> -NENA has 1800 member households
> -NENA is the most influential association in the city
> -6.6% subscribe to the e-mail and NENA website
> -Less than 6.6% pay their voluntary dues
> -Around 1% attend the quarterly meetings
> -Positions are formed by a democratic vote of members present
> -NENA does not use consensus tools ... petitions or surveys
> -NENA positions are presented in various city venues
> -Members who attend NENA meetings feel the decision process is
> adequate
>
> Questions...
> -How are all members (1800) informed of meeting agendas?
> -How are all members (1800) informed of impending votes?
> -How are non-participating members (1782) informed of final positions?
> -Once a position is cast, is there a mechanism of appeal?
> -Is there ever an issue that NENA feels is too big for the 1% to
> answer?
> -Does our elected city councilman sometimes act on NENA positions?
> -Does our elected city councilman understand decision theory
> statistics?
>
> Think briefly and honestly about our answers...
>
> NENA represents a significant population of business owners, managers,
> scientists and engineers...How we answer, may explain why many are
> absent...
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: members-bounces at noreste.org [mailto:members-bounces at noreste.org]
> On Behalf Of Paul Grunwald
> Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 11:56 PM
> To: 'NENA'; 'Nor Este Neighborhood Association Board'
> Subject: [NENA] Mailing list and communications
>
> Dear NENA Members and Board,
>
>
>
> We have had more traffic on this mailing list in the last few days
> than
> in the last year. That is what the list is for - thank you all for
> your
> thoughts and time. We are investigating adding a discussion forum to
> the website to take discussions offline but it will take a few more
> days
> to implement that feature. If the email traffic from the mailing list
> is unwanted, you have a couple of options. Option 1 - set the mailing
> subscription to digest mode. In digest mode you will get one email a
> day with all the messages. Option 2 is to unsubscribe.
>
>
>
> Both options for your subscription can be set here:
> http://noreste.org/mailman/listinfo/members_noreste.org
>
> There is a button at the bottom of the page labeled "Unsubscribe or
> Edit
> Options" where you can manage your subscription.
>
>
>
> ---------
>
> I have one other thought about the recent discussion. We have 1800
> homes in the area bounded by NENA. There are 119 subscriptions to this
> list. There are even fewer paid members today. That said, NENA is a
> legal entity as recognized by the city with binding bylaws & charter
> as
> well as a being 501 C3 organization for tax purposes.
>
>
>
> Just because people choose not to participate or join does not
> invalidate the legitimacy of the organization in just the same way as
> someone choosing not to vote does not invalidate the legitimacy of an
> election. NENA does speak for this area and is actually the largest
> and
> most influential neighborhood association in the city. NENA has done
> more to control and manage development in this area than any other
> organization in the city. Ask some of the developers and cell phone
> companies that have tangled with us...
>
>
>
> If you do not like the position that NENA is taking or may take, get
> involved, get your neighbors involved and participate in the
> organization and issues. Everyone who has been involved in NENA has
> had
> a single goal - the quality of life for this entire neighborhood. As a
> group, we can direct and guide how this area develops in real and
> practical ways for the betterment of all. Please continue to
> participate!
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
>
>
> Paul Grunwald
>
>
>
> VP Manor
>
> Treasurer
>
> Webmaster
>
> Past President
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
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